Beyond Learning

Mandi Alvarado
Jun 20
28 min read

Beyond Beautiful: Disability, Liberation, Love

Season 3, Episode 6 - Beyond Learning

🧭 Episode Summary

What happens when people decide what you're capable of before you've had the chance to prove them wrong?

In this episode of Beyond Beautiful, Mandi sits down with Michelle Steiner, a writer, advocate, paraeducator, and photographer who lives with an invisible disability. Throughout her life, Michelle was told she wouldn't be able to attend college, earn a degree, get published, or pursue the career she wanted. Yet she has done all of those things—and more.

Together, Mandi and Michelle explore learning differences, invisible disability, self-advocacy, educational barriers, and the power of believing in yourself when others

underestimate you.

This conversation is a reminder that disability does not define our potential, and that sometimes the greatest barriers we face are the expectations others place on us.

💬 Key Themes

Non-apparent disabilities
Learning
Education
Mentorship

🚨Partnership

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📜 Full Transcript

Mandi: Welcome to Beyond Disability Liberation Love. I'm Mandi, your Queer Christian Disabled host.

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Mandi: In today's episode, we're exploring what happens when people decide who you are before you've had the chance to show them. For many disabled people, one of the most persistent barriers we face isn't our disability itself, it's other people's expectations. Expectations about what we're capable of, what support we need, what kind of work we can do, whether we can live independently, pursue higher education, or achieve our goals. Those assumptions can become so common that they begin to shape the opportunities we're offered, the risks we're encouraged to take, and sometimes even the way we see ourselves. Today's episode, Beyond Learning, is about pushing past those assumptions. My guest is Michelle Steiner, a writer, advocate, paraeducator, and photographer who lives with a non apparent disability. Throughout her life, Michelle was told there were things she couldn't do. People told her she wouldn't be able to attend college, earn a bachelor's degree, get published, or pursue the work she wanted to do. Yet Michelle has done all of those things and more. She graduated from Slippery Rock University with a bachelor's degree in community programming and has written for publications including the Mighty, the Non Verbal Learning Project, the Discalcula Blog, the Reluctant, Spoonie, Kalopena Collective, Imagine the World as One Magazine, and Word Gathering. Her photography has also been featured in multiple publications. Today she works as a paraeducator, supporting students with disabilities, helping create opportunities for the next generation. In our conversation, we'll talk about non apparent disability, learning differences, educational barriers, self advocacy, and what it means to keep moving forward when others underestimate your potential. Because disability does not determine our worth, learning differently does not diminish our intelligence, and sometimes the most powerful thing we can do is refuse to let someone else's limitations become our own. So settle in and join me for this conversation with Michelle.

Mandi: Hi Michelle, welcome to Beyond Beautiful. How are you today?

Michelle: I am doing great. How are you?

Mandi: I am really good and so excited to be talking to you today. I would love for you to introduce yourself and share a little bit about your journey with learning and education.

Michelle: Sure, I'd be happy to. Well, my name is Michelle Steiner. I live in Pennsylvania with my husband Ron and our two cats, Jack and Sparrow. I am a writer, speaker, photographer and para educator. And I work in a school with students who have disabilities and some who don't. And I also have a blog called Michelle's Mission where I write about my life with a learning disability and I feature my photography and I have a learning disability myself. I have dyscalculia, which is a math learning dis. Have limited hand dexterity in both of my hands and I have visual perception issues that affects my brain, not my eyesight.

Mandi: Thank you so much for sharing all of that and I love your pets names. So cute.

Michelle: Thank you.

Mandi: Yes, I. I love Pirates of the Caribbean so they're really cute. So I know when we've spoken before you mentioned that at different points in your life people would tell you, you know, what you couldn't do. What did that feel like for you and how did it shape you?

Michelle: I think it was really hard, especially in the beginning. It was really defeating for me because I can remember I was in high school when I first heard that I had a learning support teacher who told me, well, I don't think you can go to college because of your math. And she suggested a trade school. And well, nothing in the trade school interested me. And I was just really defeated by that. And I thought, well, I knew high school was going to be hard, but I, I mean, excuse me. I knew college was going to be hard, but I definitely knew that trade school wasn't the right fit for me. And I can also remember even having other people telling me that. I had a psychiatrist who told me I would most likely not go beyond community college. And that was defeating for me because I thought, well, maybe I would want to go on the. Just to get my bachelor's at some point. And then it was difficult when I went to school and I had people that thought disability accommodations were cheating and I had an advisor who told me that I was going to have limited job choices when I graduate. So whenever I heard all these things, I became really fearful. I thought, well, this. What if this is true in my life? And it made me be really negative and really just fear the future for a lot of different things. But I just pushed forward through all that even though I was scared.

Mandi: Wow. I am so shocked that even in recent years, you know, that this Kind of stigma is still going on in our education systems and from people that many of us look up to, you know, teachers and therapists. It's really bad to hear that this stigma is being perpetuated by figures that we typically look up to. So I'm really sorry that happened to you.

Michelle: Yeah, it was hard.

Mandi: Yeah. So in living with non apparent disability or, you know, disability that people are not able to see, how do you think that has impacted the way people perceive your abilities? Like when they don't know that you have a disability, what assumptions do they make?

Michelle: A lot of times assumptions people make is that I could do anything. And that can be something that, especially when I go in for a job interview or if I get a job. People, people, if I don't tell them I have a disability, they just assume that I don't have one. And that has been something where if you have to explain to a boss or a coworker, some are better than others. But people don't realize. They think, well, what is wrong with you? Why can't you do that? You don't look like you have a disability. So it's that I have to go and I have to explain to them I'm not able to do math. All the kids know at the school that I work with that I can't do math. And a lot of my staff knows too. And it's just really important to have that communication because my disability is hidden, people can't see it. I also will get other people when I tell them about my work and that I have a learning disability, people will look at me and they'll say, well, you don't look like you're disabled and they're looking for the cane or they're looking for the wheelchair. Because we're so conditioned to be thinking about them as being physical disabilities. 1. So we can see. And I'll tell them, well, some disabilities we can see, other ones we don't, we can't. And then sometimes they might even say, oh, well, I'm giving you a compliment. And it's not a compliment. Either way, having a disability isn't, isn't a bad thing. Whether you can see it on a person or it's something that might be hidden, it's a part of life, it's a part of that person, and it's nothing to be ashamed of.

Mandi: Yeah, I really appreciate that and how you're talking about kind of that, the look of disability. I've heard that a lot, that people will say things like, you don't look disabled or for me, I have a visible physical disability. And something I've been told is, well, you're too pretty to be disabled. And it's like, what, what does that mean? Like, yeah, disability doesn't have a look. And like, it doesn't have to mean you're unattractive. Like, it's really interesting how people perceive disability in such negative ways. As you were saying. So what do you wish more people understood about non apparent or non visible disabilities, especially in educational spaces?

Michelle: I wish people would understand that disabilities that we can't see are still there. Just because you can't see somebody's disability doesn't mean that it goes away. And I think sometimes that can be really a challenge for a lot of our students, especially ones that might have autism or adhd. We, we can't see why they, they might be doing something. We might know that maybe a child that has difficulties paying attention might be up walking around the room or we might be able to see somebody that just might be struggling in the, in the classroom. That, but for, no, but they, they, you can't tell, you can't look at them and say, oh, that person has that. So I think sometimes we don't want to help. Or we, we, there's people who do want to help, but there's just that stigma that just says, well, because they can't see what the disability is, they just think, oh, people are lazy, society's lazy. That's why that child can't do it. And it's sometimes just, it's that, that is not true. It's the kid really doesn't understand it or the person can't do that and we just can't see the reasons behind that. And I've gotten pretty good at knowing when we have a student that isn't able to read in the classroom and might struggle with that, and I might go up to them and say, are you okay with reading? And sometimes they're like, no, I can't, or I don't understand what's going on. And I get that chance to sit down and to explain things to them and just, I think it's just that stigma that we just associate. Again, we just think, oh, disability is something we can see. Disability is something that is really clearly defined and sometimes people can't do that. In fact, it's also really interesting where people can't see certain aspects of my disability. But with the hand dexterity, sometimes it is becoming more apparent. I can remember I was in the grocery store one afternoon and I was Unloading the groceries. And I thought, okay, this is great. Just unloading them like I'm supposed to. And I had a woman that came up to me, and she starts unloading my cart. And I look over to her, oh, thank you. And. And she goes, yeah, I like to help people. And you really look like you needed it. And I just. As grateful as I was to have something I thought I had to handle, I mean, I've learned to adapt. I mean, how. Take things out of the. The cart and. And to be able to do that. But that. That really. I was taken aback by that because I'm not used to having that experience because for a lot of years, people just looked at me and thought, okay, why can't she do math? And now some of the other ones are kind of becoming a little more visible.

Mandi: Wow, that is really. You brought up a lot of interesting points. I have definitely heard from others as well, who. Who have disabilities that there's mixed feelings about people jumping in to help, because, like you said, you've learned to adapt and you're able to do the things in the way that you do them. But when we are out in the world doing things in a different way, it does seem to signal to people, oh, this person needs help, like, even if we've got it under control. And so it's this mixed feel. Feeling of like, oh, that's so kind, but also like, I'm good and I can do this.

Michelle: Yeah, right.

Mandi: So how do you feel that your experience in school differed from what people expected of you?

Michelle: I think when I was in school, a lot of people discounted me for not being able to do very much. I can remember I went to a very small school district where everybody knew each other, and if you were one of them, you fit in. And I didn't fit in. I. It was really apparent. I went to. I couldn't hide that. I went to learning Support to have a task read aloud to me or to have a specialized class when I needed it. And then even when I was in regular ed classes with my peers, I couldn't hide the fact that I was struggling in the. In. In the classroom. Everybody knew that it was really hard for me, and I quickly got labeled the outcast. And I think a lot of people didn't expect very much out of me. When I was in school. I really didn't have much of a connection with a lot of my peers. I found most of my friends outside of school. Even when I was a teenager, I found other groups that met outside of my School district, and I found that. And I just think that a lot of people didn't really expect too much. I mean, I had teachers, some that were really great. I had a wonderful student teacher that told me I could go to college because I knew how to study, and I worked hard. And I don't remember what this woman's name was, but I could just remember hearing that whenever it got really hard at school. So I had that, and I had some teachers in my regular ed classrooms that knew the things I was really good at, like speaking and reading, and they pushed me in those areas. And that has been something that has helped me to become a success in my life as well. And I try to really look for those things when I work with my students in the classroom. What are they good at? What do they like? And how. How can I push? But also how. How can I be understanding and helpful?

Mandi: Yeah, I love that. And kind of talking a little bit more about the. The barriers that you push through. You know, you mentioned earlier that you were told by multiple people that you wouldn't go to college or earn a degree. And, you know, you did, which is what else helped you push through those barriers.

Michelle: I think having a wonderful set of parents has been great. My mom and dad never gave up on me, and they advocated for me from a time I was a very small child. My mom and dad were there, they worked with the school. That was a really big factor. In fact, I ran into one of my first learning support teachers several years ago, and I got that chance to thank her. And of course she said, well, you put in the work. But then she said, you know, it was your mom and I working together. If my mom had a concern, she would call the school, and if the teacher had a concern, she would call my mom. And the two of them worked together to make sure that I was getting the services that I needed and that my mom and dad were supporting me. And they just worked together for my good. And I think that that was the factor. And I also remember my mom and dad, when they would go to an IEP meeting whenever I was in school, they would ask me, do you have any concerns because we're going your IEP meeting? And I would tell them what I was thinking, and they would get back to me on that. And that's before students went to their IEP meetings at a certain age and had a voice. But my mom and dad were already ahead of that. And I really credit a lot of that to my parents. And my mom was always good at advocating for me, I can remember hearing her on the phone explaining my disability to somebody and thought, wow, mom's really good at that. And that person understands. And I later had to be that person that advocated for myself because I can't rely on my parents forever. And I think that was one of the things that they really pushed was that independence because they know they're not going to be here forever. And they wanted me to have a life where I was independent from them and living that how I wanted to do that. I also think having some great friends was really a blessing too. I can remember whenever I was being bullied, I found a writing group for adults. And these people got to see me grow as a writer and a person. And about 20 some years later, probably more, we still meet once a month to talk about a writing and we're in each other's lives and oftentimes my friends, they couldn't fix some of the stuff that was going on. I can remember really struggling at school and they couldn't make that grade any better. They couldn't cure that I had a learning disability. But we could go and we could laugh on a Saturday or we could go and hang out. And I think that that was really something because it helped me to remind myself that there was more to my life than the issues that I was facing. And I had that support. And just seeing them all those years after that and just having that continuity of a relationship is helped. And my husband is great too. He is really supportive with having a disability.

Mandi: Yeah. So I'm hearing a couple things like really that it's important to have role models to advocate on your behalf, but then also to teach. Teach individuals how to advocate for themselves. And in your case it was your parents. But I think for many people it could be, you know, it could be a teacher or it could be, you know, a parental figure or the parents. And I love that your mom in particular, like you learned kind of how to explain, explain your disability from the way she was explaining it. So that's amazing. And then I'm hearing that piece of community being really important. And I do think we in the disability community tend to build these like very strong long term friendships. I'm very similar. My friends I've had for like a really long time as well. And I think when you find those good people who can really support you, you really just hold on to those relationships and in a different way. So I love that you're still meeting with that writing group and that it's gone beyond writing that you all really care about the other parts of your lives. And then the last thing that was really special about what you just said is that your community is not trying to fix the problems. Right. They're not trying to change the grade or make things better, but just being there for you and sharing in the experience. And I think that's important whether a person is disabled or not. Right. We don't always need someone to try and fix something or change something about us. Sometimes we just need to be in community with good people. So I love that you mentioned that. So, you know, you were talking a little bit about your successes now, and I would love to know, like, how do you define success for yourself? Especially after navigating the negative messages that people said to you?

Michelle: Right. I can remember my dad always telling me, success sometimes comes in the package that you. You don't expect, but sometimes it comes in something better. And that, to me, has really been key. It used to be I thought, oh, I'll be. I'll define success when I don't have this disability, and then I'm able to achieve every dream that I. That I have. And every time I have success or I achieve something, I. I completed a goal. But that doesn't mean that my disability has gone away. Now I look at it where success for me is. I'm out there. I'm doing the very best that I can do. I am going after the things that I love, and I feel like I'm making a difference. And to me, I'll always have that disability. And that maybe success may not look that way to everybody, but for me, I feel like if I know that I put forward my best effort and I put my heart into it, that no matter what the outcome is, that that was definitely my best and only competing with myself. And I just think that if it doesn't work one way doesn't mean that we just have to look for a different way to. For it to work out.

Mandi: I love that. And I love that your definition of success goes beyond disability. I mean, I think the way you're defining success is how anyone could really define success for themselves. It's about, like you said, competing with yourself, not doing the comparison game or looking to the person next to you, but just setting your own goals and achieving the dreams that you have for yourself, even if you're doing that in a different way than maybe what is expected. And I think anyone can take that message away. So I really appreciate that. I do want to talk a little bit about some of the outcomes of your Success, which is your writing. So you've been published across multiple platforms. What role has writing played in your journey?

Michelle: Writing has given me a voice with a disability. I can remember writing a story about a dinosaur in second or third grade, and my dad finding it and said, wow, this is really good. And I didn't think I was good at anything up until that point. And I. I remember reading and writing really became my world. And when I joined that writing group as a teenager, and I can remember one of the members said, gina, all of them really were saying, you should write about having a learning disability. And I was still at that point in my disability where I was like, oh, no, that's way too personal. I don't want to go there. So I think I wrote some really bad poetry and some other things I would not want to share today. I finally got that voice, though, whenever I moved into our house, and I could not unlock our door because I was just diagnosed with limited hand dexterity. And I was so frustrated that there was a call on the mighty for what's a seemingly easy task for others, but it's hard for your disability. And I wrote about that. And when it got published, it was one of the greatest things that ever happened. And I had such great. Such a great response that I wrote more for them and I wrote for some other places. And I started my own blog called Michelle's Mission, where I write about my learning disability. And writing has also helped me to be able to just make sense of my world and to be able to forgive other people. I remember there was one person in particular in my past that I was having. I had a lot of difficulties with, and I couldn't forgive this person. And when I finally wrote this story and I said everything that I wanted to say, I forgave that person. And I can remember I had a funeral with this person a few years back. And we. We were able to put our life right before that person passed, a few years before, actually. And we. We were able to rebuild that and have a good relationship, and there was no regrets when that person passed. And I think that I. I owe a lot of that credit to writing and getting out those feelings, those frustrations.

Mandi: That is such a powerful story. And I have definitely heard of writing being a really great healing tool. And I love that you are sharing your writing with others, but I even think some of that private and personal writing, too, can be very beneficial for people's journeys. So I really love the story that you shared, though, that you were able to use your writing to get to a better place for yourself. Forgive someone, even if you didn't tell them specifically, I forgive you. But just the process for yourself, I think, is very powerful. And you were talking a little bit about storytelling, and so I would love to know how you feel. Storytelling helps to challenge ableism and shift narratives around learning and intelligence.

Michelle: I think by hearing other people's stories, that is so important, because whenever I was growing up, I didn't hear of many people that had learning disabilities. I didn't hear about many females that had them. And all of the literature was about white males that were in college, and they all had reading disabilities or dyslexia. And I remember feeling, well, I don't have a reading disability. I'm female. And what in. You know, I just didn't know how I fit into that. And I really felt alone because most of my peers that I was with, too, had math or, excuse me, they had reading disabilities. And some have behavior issues. And, I mean, there was couple girls in my class, but there was a lot more boys. And I just didn't have that idea of that representation. So I think that was really difficult. But I think that storytelling. And as time progressed and we came up with social media, I got to meet other people that did have map learning disabilities and were girls and some were guys. And I think that was really something too, because what that did was it opened the world. I'm not alone. There's other people that have my kind of disability. There's other people that can't drive. There's other people that can't read the Facebook clock or do math. And I think that that really helps to be able to have that by sharing our stories and being that honest and being that brave and vulnerable. And whenever I share my story and my struggles and I'm honest about it, that gives other people that permission to feel, well, I can share my story. I can share where I'm struggling at and that nobody has it all together. And there are people that do have disabilities. I still hear from people that will say, oh, you work in a school. Are there other kids like you? Are there other students that. That are like you? And I'm like, yeah, I mean, there are other people that do have learning disabilities like mine. It's not uncommon for that. But I think it's through speaking and telling our stories that we're able to be able to show what life is like for us. Having it for a person having a disability.

Mandi: Yeah, for sure. And I think it's so important to have voices in this space like yours that do have the lived experience. Because when we think about representation, whether it's in writing or in visual media, for a long time it was non disabled people trying to tell our stories. And a lot of times it didn't reflect the real experiences that we have. It was, you know, inaccurate or very sensationalized to highlight certain parts as, you know, inspirational for all of the wrong reasons. So it's so important to have people telling their own stories from within the community. So representation really matters. And I think accurate representation and I really love too that it's not just the bad sides or the successful side either. I mean it's just people living their everyday lives and adapting. I keep thinking of that story you shared about the grocery store. Like that's such a everyday task. Like that people do a very common thing and as someone with a disability, it becomes so sensationalized that, you know, we're bagging groceries and putting them in our car. So yeah, it's important to have these stories told through the proper lens.

Michelle: Exactly.

Mandi: So what does learning mean to you now?

Michelle: Learning means for me now I'm learning new things every day. I mean they, they always say you learn something new every day and when you are first goal you, sometimes you do learn new things. But I also have, when I watch my students, I learn things too. There's just ways that I learn different things about people. I learn how different people might think, how different people learn and just some of that reactions and I realize they're learning too. They're not just through their lessons, but they're learning how I interact with them. They're learning how I interact with staff. They're learning how I even show them how to advocate if they don't understand something. And I think that that's just something that we always are learning. Every single day we learn how to do something. And sometimes there are some things that I'm probably not going to be able to master and learn with a disability. Math might be one of them. But that's okay because there's other things in my life that I am able to do and just the learning never ends in life. Yeah.

Mandi: And I love that learning doesn't have to be defined by going to school or you know, and, and you were talking about trade school earlier. Right? And like there's nothing wrong with that being a pathway for some people, but it also shouldn't be something that you're just relegated to because people are underestimating what you're able to do. Right. Like there are so many different pathways. And I, I think it's important for people to know that. Right. Like maybe trade school is great for some people, that is a good pathway. And for others, you know, I think we're in a society now where like college and universities are very costly, it's very expensive and people are, you know, in their 50s and 60s, still paying off their college years and college may not be for everyone. And that is also okay. You can still be successful and like you said, not compare yourself to what others are doing and have your own path and that can be okay.

Michelle: Exactly. It's a person centered approach. And I think that that is what sometimes might be missing. It's what, first of all, what does that person want to do? And after we know what we want to do, let's find a way to be able to get there. But it shouldn't be a default option. And I think that's part of the issue as well.

Mandi: Yeah, absolutely. So this kind of bleeds into like my next question with that person centered approach. Can you expand on that? Especially when we're talking about transformation and what transformation can look like in the way that we approach education?

Michelle: I think when you're, when you're doing a person centered approach, you're customizing that for that person. It's not for a group of people. It's not for, oh, we're, we're people that have a learning disability. This is what they need, every single one of them. Or people that have a physical disability, this is what they do. I think it's looking at that person as an individual and thinking, what services do they need? What is, first of all, what do they want? Do they want to go to trade school? Great. If they're interested. Wonderful. Let's look into that. Do they want to go to college? Great. Let's look into those services and the plan that they would need for that. Or do they want to work? And that's another viable option too, where we can look into it and just seeing what services and being honest too about that as well. If I, I, for example, whenever I was deciding about college, I knew that I wanted to go and I wanted to work with students, but I knew being a certified teacher wasn't going to be a wise career path for me. I couldn't pass the certification tests and I knew some of the coursework would be hard, especially with math and, but I looked at my other options and thought, okay, what can I do with that? And I was able to find a program that had the least amount of math and science Possible didn't require a certification and I was able to do that. And that was setting me up for being a success in life. And everybody's different. And then I also think it goes beyond just maybe a classroom or a job. It goes beyond, well, where is this person going to live? Are they going to be able to. Do they want to be independent? They want to live on their own? Are they going to need services to be able to have that independence? Or is it a best option for them to be in a group home or to live at home with their parents and have services that come into the house? I mean, that, that can be another option. Or is it to live with friends? What do they love to do in their free time too? I think that's something that's important. What does somebody love to do? Do they like to read? Do they like to write? Do they like to play baseball? Do they want to play a musical instrument? I think it's looking at that whole person and really taking all those factors in and helping that person and providing the proper supports for them to become the best version of themselves that they can be and to lead a life that is meaningful and is centered around what their needs are.

Mandi: Yes, yes, yes to all of this. And I love that you're talking about the different pathways again, because we do tend to stigmatize different living environments. And I think of so many movie tropes where, you know, the person's in their 30s and living at home and how frowned upon that is like, oh, you're 35 and still home and there's so many people with disabilities who do need that kind of support, who may not be able to live alone or, you know, who their parents may be, their primary caregivers for many years and later it may even get passed down to a sibling or another close relative. But that doesn't necessarily diminish that person's quality of life. In fact, having the supports that you need in whatever way that you need them really gives you the highest quality of life, even if it looks different. So, you know, I think sometimes that 35 year old person who has high needs and is living at home may even have a higher quality of life than if they were living on their own or even living in a group home. You know, it just, it is so different for every person. And I really appreciate that you're highlighting that.

Michelle: Yeah.

Mandi: So for any parents or educators or even allies that might be listening today, what is one thing that they can do to better support people with learning disabilities?

Michelle: One of the first things I think they can do is to regard them with compassion and understanding. I think that is the biggest key. I hear a lot of people that might say, I don't understand, why aren't they trying their best? Why, why aren't they? Why are they just wanting to give up? And I. And they, they can't understand that. They say, well, even it's hard. Why, why are they giving up? And I would tell someone if they feel that way, to consider self fortunate because when I know what that's like to sit there in front of a test or a paper and really feel defeated even before you take it. So I think it's that understanding that this is really hard. It's not impossible, but it's hard for that person and to really reach out and to offer that support, to be able to have that backing of that person and then that way where they can also push a little bit too. But I think that's just an understanding that learning disabilities are there, they impact a person and it's just a consideration for that.

Mandi: Yeah, and I have recently been thinking about this. So I have two younger children who attend public school school and right now we're in the midst of the state testing and you know, there have been so many debates about testing, standardized testing and what that really tells us and is it truly reflective of a student's intelligence or abilities or even their future. And you know, for a long time we had schools that were really depending on the scores of these tests to determine labels for children. And I'm really happy that for many states there has been this shift to giving parents power to have their children not take the tests and not have consequences for doing that. But you know, I have a 9 year old son who has just been having so much anxiety about these tests and I think that performance anxiety can be a good thing and you know, is typical. But I think it's important for people to know, like you said, these types of testing in our education system is not the end all, be all for everyone. You don't have to be a straight A student or have great grades or have high scores on tests to have a really great life quality and be able to still find your passion and contribute even to society. So I appreciate you really uplifting all of that. So as we're starting to wrap up, I would love to know what something is that you're proud of that maybe people don't immediately see.

Michelle: I think one of the things that I am proud of is that ability to have empathy for my students. I Think sometimes maybe that's not something that people might be. Might be familiar with. But when I go and I get to work with my students, I have an ability to be able to emphasize with a lot of them, not every single one of them, because some people do have different experiences than I do, and that's okay. But for a lot of my students, I get that chance to know what a lot. What they're thinking because sometimes, like, hear me, I'm recording myself. I hate my learning disability. I think I'm. I don't think I'm smart, and I can actually go in there and say, I know what it's like, and you are smart and you can do it. And that's not something that somebody can do until they really walked in the shoes of somebody that's had one.

Mandi: Absolutely. And I think it's so important for, again, going back to representation, but real representation in workplaces, in schools, because it does give such a different perspective. And there's so many of us out there. Like, we often feel so alone and isolated, but there's so many of us with different types of disabilities and different access needs. And it's really nice to connect with people who just get it and who really understand it in a real way. So I know you mentioned your blog, and we will put the link to your blog in the show notes for people to be able to check out. But where can people learn more about your work or stay connected with you?

Michelle: You can find me at my blog, www.michellesmission.com and I'm also on Facebook and Instagram as well.

Mandi: Awesome. And I'll be sure to share your socials in the show notes as well as your blog so people can follow along. Michelle, thank you so much for being so vulnerable and sharing your story with me today. I really appreciated learning more about you, and I just know that this message of, you know, not underestimating people and having these different pathways to success will really resonate not just with people with disabilities, but with everyone. I think we can all benefit from that mind shift. So thank you so much.

Michelle: Well, thank you very much. It's been a pleasure.

Mandi: As we wrap up today's episode, I want to thank Michelle for sharing her story and reminding us that other people's expectations. Expectations do not define our potential. One of the things I appreciate most about Michelle's journey is that it challenges the idea that disability, learning differences, or the labels others place on us determine what's possible. Her life is a powerful reminder that growth often happens when we keep moving forward, even when others doubt our ability. If today's conversation resonated with you, I'd love to hear your thoughts. What assumptions have you had to overcome? What barriers have you broken through? Connect with me on social media and let's continue the conversation. And before I go, I have a special announcement. The next edition of Mandy Mail will be going out soon and subscribers will be the first first to hear about ticket access for an upcoming two part live workshop series called Breaking Biblical Barriers. Part one will focus on the barriers LGBTQ individuals often face in faith spaces and practical ways those barriers can be broken down to create communities rooted in belonging, dignity and love. Part two, taking place in July, will explore disability through a more inclusive biblical lens and challenge some of the assumptions that have historically excluded disabled people from full participation in faith communities. If you're passionate about disability, justice, lgbtq, inclusion, faith, or creating communities where everyone can belong, this workshop series is for you. To make sure you receive early access to tickets and all the details, be sure to sign up for Mandy Mail. I'd love to have you join us. Thank you as always for your support, for listening and for being part of this community. Until next time, remember, disability liberation love are always beyond beautiful.

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